To pay or not to pay

Was talking to a fellow Bail Agent here in NC recently and he asked me a question (actually wanted my opinion) concerning paying a newly licensed Bail Agent when he accompanies me on a recovery.

In my state, a newly licensed Agent has to find a supervising agent prior to doing any bail related work. The supervising agent is responsible for the actions of the agent being supervised.

My response was that I don't want anybody working with me and not be paid, however if the agent comes with me to observe and learn then I really have to watch my back and his and frankly in the beginning, the guy is a liability to me and until he shows he can handle the work" my way" and I don't have to to watch his back and mine at the same time, I don't feel he should be paid with "money". He's actually gaining the experience needed to do it own his own.

Not saying this guy works for me the enire year with no pay, I wouldn't do that, but until I feel he can handle things when and if they get nasty his pay is experience only.

Feel free to blast me on this one, but that's the way it is.

_________________
Bill Williams
Bail Agent
Eagle Bonding Services
Asheville NC 28804
828-777-8667
Lic # NC10013561
Lic # TN 2033018

Never be haughty to the humble
or humble to the haughty - Jefferson Davis

Well I am not going to bash you Bill.. every state ..and every company is different on how they operate.

Here in FL a newbie has to "Intern" for 1540 Hours prior to being allowed to take the Final State Exam to get his FULL Bail Bonds License.

During the Intern's time working for a company and in MY personal experience as an intern .. I was NEVER PAID.. were some other Interns Paid when working for different companies .. yes they were.. and then again some others like myself were not paid as well too. Guess it is a pick and choose thing when looking for work as an intern.

Now being FULLY licensed even if its one day with the License after passing the Final Exam .. I will NOT go on a pick up unless I get paid.. and it is usually 10% of the bond (which is split between my partner and I).. take it or leave it or find someone else to do the pick up. The Companies I work for pay, and I am very content on my working relationship with the companies I am involved with.

Have I taken an Intern with me for a pickup .. YES INDEED.. but they offered to come along so therefore in my book I do agree with you Bill that they are gaining experience and I have not paid them but sometimes have picked up the tab for lunch if the hunt went longer than expected with negative results on the capture..

_________________
JEFF P.
Limited Surety Agent (FL) - License # P_2O8124_
Private Investigator (FL) - License # C_27OOO33_
NABBI Member



"Surprise Sex is the Best Thing to Wake up to, UNLESS, You are in Jail... "

Bill, after working with you on a few pick-ups anyone new to this business should be thankful to gain some of your knowledge. After 2-3 weeks of watching you work on a computer and seeing your phone skills would show a newbee what it takes to make a good recovery agent. Any one you train would make a very good agent and would do everything by the book or you would not waste your time with them.
I hope to do more work with you in the near future and learn from the best. See you tomorrow for our continuing education class. 4:00AM will be way to early, but we must get it over with.

_________________
Blackjack Bail Bonds
828-277-7110(Bonds only)
828-275-7353 cell

If you are mentoring this person under the pre-arranged agreement that he/she will not be receiving any financial compensation, then there's no problem. Your apprentice is getting a free education. Back when I first got my start in this industry, I had no mentor to hold my hand and watch my back on a daily basis. I was entirely on my own and I had to learn things the hard way. So, to have the privilege of learning from a seasoned veteran is worth its weight in gold. With that said, it wouldn't hurt to throw your apprentice a bone once in a while. Maybe treat the apprentice to lunch once in a while. Maybe prepare some lessons to teach the apprentice new things on a regular basis, besides/in addition to the daily chores. A little incentive can go a long way and it gives us all a reason to continue. Just think of the confidence booster that you could be to your apprentice. That could earn you many treasures and limitless respect. Your apprentice will sing praises of your training methods and approaches.

_________________
Jason Pollock
Owner/Operator
Surety Risk Management
Los Angeles, California
(323) 786-FIND

"Approach is Everything."

Very cool that the last comment/reply about mentoring should come from one of MY early mentors!

_________________
Tom Duprey
Founding member, NABBI (Nat'l Assoc. of Bail Bond Inv.)
Ca. Bail Agent Lic#1845795
Owner/Operator, Thomas Duprey Bail Bonds
Owner/Operator, Orange County Bounty
(714) 727-4689

Sometimes, maybe most times I don't make my thoughts clear, when writing a post. First, I would never not pay anyone without that agreement going in, second I always buy lunch, breakfast loan a few bucks or whatever. In fact I have paid people while supervising them. Over the years however, I've stopped that practice because the work takes me longer, they are not always ready to go when it's time to go and frankly they sometimes slow me down among other things. Once they are an asset I'm ready to pay them their fair share. Until then I'll continue to buy breakfast lunch supper snacks and loan a few bucks etc.

If that isn't clear, it's the best I got.

_________________
Bill Williams
Bail Agent
Eagle Bonding Services
Asheville NC 28804
828-777-8667
Lic # NC10013561
Lic # TN 2033018

Never be haughty to the humble
or humble to the haughty - Jefferson Davis

Sounds to me like you're taking pretty good care of your people and that you're doing a good job. Keep up the good work. They will follow you in to places that no other person would want to go.

_________________
Jason Pollock
Owner/Operator
Surety Risk Management
Los Angeles, California
(323) 786-FIND

"Approach is Everything."

I went out recently with Randall Crew and Leo Lion on one of their cases. I was upfront about wanting to go for the experience and wasn't worried about being paid. Lion did buy me a couple lunches and a breakfast. After everything was said and done, he sent me a check for $25, completely unsolicited, to help cover some of my gas. I was more than happy with that.

The experience I got with those two was worth more to me than any amount they could have paid. In fact, the skip ended up running on us twice, and ended up getting picked up but a LEO at a later date. I'm not even sure they got paid anything. I just hope I was able to contribute something to them as well.


I think lunch/coffee for somebody you're taking under your wing is satisfactory. If they end up providing a value to you at some point, maybe kick a bonus down. If they don't provide anything that you wouldn't have had already on your own, I see no reason to feel obligated to pay anything extra.

_________________
Demian Ross
Acacia Consulting Group
916.241.FIND(3463)
1.877.556.3678
California PC1299 Compliant Fugitive Recovery
Process Serving
Mobile Notary
Security Consulting

This can be a tough scenario. Everything must be clear up front regarding being paid. Usually, like Bill said, dragging someone along with me is a liability and is looked on as another slice out of a shrinking pie. First and foremost, I will surround myself with people that I am confident will react in a particular manner. I never know how a new person will respond in a "Come to Jesus" meeting, and frankly, neither do they. I always look out for those that accompany me. The reasons are selfish. I have spent a career establishing a reputation for integrity and behavior that is above and beyond reproach, and I will not compromise that for anything. The last thing that I need is someone bad mouthing me because of an inflated sense of importance, value or ego. With a big picture outlook, nothing is free, not experience, education or reputation. More than a few that have worked with me have left because they thought they deserved a larger share of a capture, regardless if they were available every time we went out, or already knew everything, in their immature opinion. How many of us are alone when doing the internet research, court file checks, pretext phone calls, all to turn an investigation into a body snatch case, and the guys that only show up for the apprehension want half!

I apologize for hijacking this post, but this topic is a pet peeve of mine. Free has no value, never has, never will. When you are new, you quickly realize how hard it is to get work in the first place. So why is it that they forget that so quickly and have no respect for their benefactor. Bob Reilly put a post on here about posting a bond with me and having a Bounty Hunter start talking himself up in the Commissioner's office about how good he was, then said he worked for me, and was staring right at me, and had no clue who I was. Bob was laughing so hard, he had to leave the office. I was in shock!

Gotta love this biz!

Scott

_________________
R.E. "Scott" MacLean III

"Leaders are like Eagles, you never see them in a flock, but one at a time"

Chesapeake Group Investigations, Inc.
Chesapeake Bail Bonds
877-574-0500
301-392-1100 (fax)
301-392-1900 (Office)