Badge questions

Thank you much for all of the feedback, I will definately keep all of this in mind when the time comes! I wasn't sure if the badge was a good idea or not... it does kind of seem like a bad idea now that I've heard all of this. I was planning on just wearing street clothes, I might buy some body armor, but I won't wear it on every recovery... that would be a waste of time! But, with my street clothes, I am going to wear Bail enforcement shirts where the lettering is big and bold so that people will NOT confuse me with any sort of government agent or LEO... Thanks again for the feedback...

Jake

If you will permit me, allow me to post this advice:

1) Attire: Attire is based, in my opinion on a number of qualifying variables.

a) Does subject have a history of violence ? Use weapons ? firearm charges ? etc

b) Date, Time, location of apprehension: Residential or commercial ? potential for vicarious and collateral liability ? Day time vs Night time ?

c) State Laws

d) Attitude of local leo's regarding BEA's (Most leo's do not appreciate us wearing SWAT like uniforms, black BDU's etc.)

e) Body Armour: concealed or tactical ?

So you see there is alot that goes into planning an apprehension. Believe it or not most of us process all of this stuff automatically, it's 2nd nature to us.

The next key is to utilize our "family". If you have a case in another state, partner up with a local BEA. "Share the Pie" so to speak. 9 times out of 10 that BEA will reciprocate case work. Over the last 18 mos or so I have farmed out or referred case work to most of the regulars on this sight and they've done the same. Networking here works.

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River City Associates
Decatur, Al. 35601

I am surprised no one thought of this earlier...

" Badges ? I don't need no stinkin' badges !...."

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River City Associates
Decatur, Al. 35601

Thanks again for all of the advice and feedback. I look forward to working with all of you in the very near future.

Sad.

Mr. Moon,

Your position is well stated and sound. So please do not construe my rebuttal as "Slamming you".

1) Our position is not active, proactive or reactive law enforcement roles for the the good of public safety. We are recovery contractor's hired to perform a service in a civil matter. Very similar to repo personnel who are hired to recover vehicles, construction equipment, boats, etc.

2) In most states, if you are in any way affiliated with an LE agency, you are prohibited by state laws from engaging in BEA work. So you are fortunate that MI. allows you to do this. 1 of our jails just fired 3 jailers for doing BEA work in thier off time.

3) Then you get into colour of law issues, search warrants, etc.

4) If you carry some sort of an ID card and present it upon first contact with your skip or co-signer, present yourself in a professional manner, explain who and what you are and why you are there, then there shouldn't be any kind of confusion regarding your apprehension.

5) Attire/Equipment: I have, as well as others, written many, many articles on this topic. Not every single apprehension you go on is a high risk one, therefore negating the "SWAT" routine. Granted, on high risk cases yes, do so. But on your ordinary, run of the mill non-violent dui skip regular street clothes suffice. Now, having said all of this, I will wear on occasion, a BEA t-shirt with reflective lettering on it if working at night, for safety and identification reasons.

Additionally, alot of cases require surveillance. How can you utilize "Urban Camoflauge" if you are tacked out like a cop ?

6) 1 of the main reasons for being so strict on attire and equipment is because of the LE community itself. They don't like it (generally speaking), they don't want it, and they are the ones we have to get along with. Like the saying goes, "When in Rome...."

7) I do agree with you that when percieved as some kind of LEO the cooperation increases; but that can also backfire if they are experienced with the laws themselves and start demanding search warrants, asking for Miranda rights, or thier lawyer. etc.

Lastly, ours is not a new process of arrest. Rather it is an extension of the original arrest by the initiating LE agency. So that is why I use the term "apprehension" or "recovery" as oposed to "arrest". I do not "arrest" anyone. Only LEO's can do that and in some cases citizens, but that's another discussion.

I hope my views will help to clear up some of your questions.

Stay safe, take care, and God Bless.

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River City Associates
Decatur, Al. 35601

Terry--excellant post--here in NH there is no law against wearing a badge and we do--not to id ourselves to the bad guy or public but to responding leo if ca-ca hits the fan even though we wear cloths that state who we are--remember the human animal is very sight oriented and when the badge is spotted by responding pd we are ided as good guys quickly


we use a nypd detective style badge-no pd in the state uses this badge--we wear it on a chain around our neck in plain sight--

the big problem comes from the way most impersonation laws are written --ie would a resonable person take you for leo--uniform badge gun vest -- most likely --but then again what is a reasonable person-- this debate will go on forever--again it is my belief until the feds get involved we will continue to have this discussion---I also believe if you are licensed by the state you should be issued id cards and badges--or should have a badge style and wording specified by the state

Sad no 2

While in Michigan in February local Police told me I could not carry my Tazer but I can do it legally here. My point is that every state has it's own reasons for the differing laws regarding what we can and cannot do and this goes to say that we should probably embrace some form of Federal guidlines to alleviate the differences between the states.

The Police in Michigan were very professional and it was a pleasure to work with them even after they freaked a little when I asked if I could strap on the Tazer for entry.

Mr. Moon,

I agree with you and I think the majority of experienced BEA's would also that when engaging in a "high risk" or high threat level apprehension that using 'ID rags" and BPV's are certainly acceptable.

Like the leo rule says: "Every one of us (cops) goes home tonight ". That's it.

I also agree with you that practices and methods of performing our tasks vary from community to community.

You are also 100% correct in that everything is about training. When the crap hits the fan, we will always instictively react according to our training. If we haven't been trained, then that's when people get killed or injured, law suits happen, and we get crucified in the media.

California requires that you attend a minimum course that covers basic laws, rights, some self defense tactics, and proper cuffing techniques. They also offer weapons training at additional cost if you so desire it. The course I took lasted about 8 weeks, 2 nights a week, 3 hours a class session and 2-8 hr. sessions on Saturdays; 3 if you took the firearms section.

I think that a course designed specifically around the BEA industry which also included firearms training, physical training in take downs, cuffing techniques, prisoner transports, etc. should be adopted on a national level. Sort of like a leo minimum P.O.S.T. standards course say intially 40 hrs ? We could offer it as a 5 day, 8 hrs./day session; or 5 saturdays at 8hrs/day, or whatever. The point is that like alot of other veteran BEA's have stated we need national licensing and training.

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River City Associates
Decatur, Al. 35601