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 Post subject: Re: Critique for Education Purpose Only
 Post Posted: Tue 17 Jan 2012 02:02 
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Joined: Thu 21 Jul 2011 19:26
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Location: Minnesota
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Firing at the windshield; that was just dumb. If that window had perhaps had some light damage, and the pepper balls hit a stress point, there could have been pepper balls picking up glass shards and carrying them into someone's skin. I have seen windshields break from less. Too much pepper ball use, too much gung-ho behaviour.

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 Post subject: Re: Critique for Education Purpose Only
 Post Posted: Tue 17 Jan 2012 12:21 
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Joined: Thu 17 Jun 2010 20:14
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Too much hair...

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 Post subject: Re: Critique for Education Purpose Only
 Post Posted: Sat 11 Feb 2012 15:59 
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AcaciaCon wrote:
Too much hair...

And not enough shirts!

My critique...
In my state that would not have warranted self defense on the part of the fugitive. However, the use of force applied to the defendant is bordering on the unlawful. And any unlawful force can be resisted.

Once the SUV door came open, the first thing they should have done was place the defendant on the ground. Using pepper balls at such close range can cause lacerations to the skin. The driver (though part of the setup) was exposed to significant risk of personal injury by the use of the pepper ball ammunition.

If the driver was not on bail, and was only part of the setup; Using physical force to subdue and then restrain her is a VERY bad idea. Easily leads to false arrest or kidnapping charges.

Someone in the cluster should have been looking out for the agents occupied with stabilizing and restraining the defendant. Maybe that was Beths job, but she was too busy running her mouth. There is never a way to know who might come to the aid of the fugitive. With 3 guys looking down at the fugitive it's pretty easy to over run them with just about anything.

The name calling and the yelling are.. un called for. The goal is to attract LESS attention, not more. Screaming at your fugitive does nothing except possibly pi$s them off and leave you out of breath.

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 Post subject: Re: Critique for Education Purpose Only
 Post Posted: Sun 12 Feb 2012 00:03 
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Joined: Tue 24 Jan 2012 02:29
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Location: Aurora, Colorado
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Good Thread!!!

I never saw an episode of Dog the Bounty Hunter before I trained and got certified as an FRA myself. When talking with Agent X one day, he surprised me when he said he watches every episode. I was incredulous, but he explained there are some good things to learn from the show, and some that are teaching moments of what NOT to do! After that conversation, I started watching and see what he meant.

One of the shows I saw was of this particular incident. I know somebody else posted a link to the story in Huffington Post, but I'd like to offer a second link about the story. WARNING! The Mesa County Sheriff uses language in much the same way as I do! LOL!

http://www.gjsentinel.com/news/articles ... lkey_rips/

That one is from the local paper in Grand Junction.

Now as to the incident!
They had cooperation from the driver, who was helping set up the fugitive. They knew in advance of her coming. Why not ask local LEO for a civil assist?

Shooting pepper balls at the vehicle was excessive. They had plenty of boots on the ground to surround the vehicle and take the fugitive without any such dramatic display.

With the driver removed and cuffed (for dramatic effect), they really didn't need to pull open the door and blast the fugitive! This had the entertaining effect of affecting their own agents, who are seen in the aftermath trying to clear their own eyes of pepper powder.

My personal perspective is that the situation was handled in a reckless fashion. Failure to decontaminate him was sloppy and negligent. Using pepper balls fired from a gas operated weapon unnecessary in the situation. The team escalated use of force to high level right out of the chute rather than the progressive scale of force as required under POST training required for all FRAs certified in Colorado.

With the cooperation of the young lady who drove him to his capture, I'd have asked for civil assist from local law enforcement. Let them be the display of force, while the fugitive is taken without all that fuss. But my approach wouldn't have made dramatic viewing.

Or, like the good sheriff of Mesa County said in his remarks;
“genuine profit-driven peacockery.”

I also loved the sheriff's comment about Dog:
“During the scuffle the skip was pepper-sprayed excessively and Dog conveniently had his tear-away shirt ripped off, all the time the action cameras were rolling and everyone was salivating in the drama ... “

That's why the capture went down as it did. Good viewing.

My critique ends with the observation that incidents like this only make life tougher for genuinely hard working Fugitive Recovery Agents who must deal with public perceptions raised by this balony!

Then again, what do I know. I've been in this business for about 5 minutes now!
Mel

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